******* by any other name

 Another one to add to your list but i must admit there are a few "Kinks" in the engine.

Ryuuji Takasu wrote:

Spoiler:

 Another one to add to your list but i must admit there are a few "Kinks" in the engine.

This brings up an important warning I forgot to mention. Do not combine different engines just for the sake of it or to fill space, always have a specific goal in mind and be sure that what you are creating is better than any one of its parts. It doesn't have to be better at everything or even better overall, but it has to be able to do at least one specific thing better and efficiently. For example, if I were given this deck for fixing, I would probably make it a single engine deck just with the addition of zexal weapons, or make it into something different if I was given a clear goal. To bring one solution up, a more focused geargia engine with added control would produce more advantage, be more consistent AND have the ability to disrupt the opponent at the same time. Similarly, a gogogo zombie engine would again be more consistent, require less resources for its plays, would retain the ability to disrupt and would be able to use high attack monsters even without special plays. Rather than taking the ability to build outside of archetypes as a chance to flex our creative muscles, it is more about being more efficient than before and discovering something that indeed works better.

This deck has been getting a lot of criticism lately because it looks so wild. It actually has a goal and achieves it very effectively. The main goal of the deck is to horde your opponent with XYZ Monsters. Specifically rank 4 monsters and even deeper Utopia. The real play style of the deck is to summon at least 2 level 4 monsters at the same turn without being disrupted. Although most people would prefer the deck to be mainly 1 or 2 Archetypes it simply cannot do with my play style. Although I most likely can't out post you and force you to agree with the set-up, I can give you this ! peice of advice: Try It. It works, surprisingly so. As for defensive play, the Geargiano hord or Gogogo swarm work good enough.

Ryuuji Takasu wrote:

This deck has been getting a lot of criticism lately because it looks so wild. It actually has a goal and achieves it very effectively. The main goal of the deck is to horde your opponent with XYZ Monsters. Specifically rank 4 monsters and even deeper Utopia. The real play style of the deck is to summon at least 2 level 4 monsters at the same turn without being disrupted. Although most people would prefer the deck to be mainly 1 or 2 Archetypes it simply cannot do with my play style. Although I most likely can't out post you and force you to agree with the set-up, I can give you this ! peice of advice: Try It. It works, surprisingly so. As for defensive play, the Geargiano hord or Gogogo swarm work good enough.

"horde your opponent with XYZ Monsters" is not a specific play or a specific way to achieve certain plays or conditions, it does not refer to the use of a card in order to justify the choice of it over the choice of other cards. Summoning 2 level 4 monsters is something that can be done by an incredible amount of cards in ygo as of now, spread through several different archetypes, so the matter of having efficiency in doing so is what is important in such cases. If you would like, I could prepare a rundown of rank 4 engines in the game with restrictions and settup requirements, as well as resources needed and consistency to help with deckbuilding.

I repeat: Try it. If you want more details on what HORDING YOUR OPPONENT WITH 2000+ MONSTERS can acheive i suggest you try google or play something more complex... like Uno.

The only thing "hording the opponent with 2000+ monsters" alone achieves in ygo is small pressure.
Examples: You summon multiple 2000+ atk monsters in a turn but are neither able to atk because of certain restrictions (or are stopped by a response) in the same turn nor are you able to capitalize on them. The opponent uses one of the commonly seen cards: Dark Hole, Mirror Force, Torrential Tribute, Exciton Knight, Jeweled Red Dragon Archfiend, Black Rose Dragon, etc. or perhaps more archetype specific cards like Judgment Dragon, Cyber Eltanin (both common at this moment), Crystal Abundance, Short Circuit, Thunder Spark Dragon etc., perhaps there were machines among them for some reason so CFD can do it alone, or perhaps is able to just top the flood with a card like Beelze, King of Dark Dragons or by methodically clearing the field, for example Ice Beast Zerofyne negates, then Shining Honors Ark Knight picks the higher target, then they both take out the next two most important ones, etc. or for extreme examples, is just able to OTK over them because one of the monsters summoned had 2800 atk, so a chronomally deck will just go bones, get the skull that searched jet, summon jet, summon nebra disk, go fork hoyuk + machu mech for exactly 8000 damage without needing to clear the field.

A "flood" needs to be also achieving a goal. For example, it can be made towards an OTK, like Hieratic combos or Rekindling based strategies. It can be made to pressure while gaining resources or keeping the already existing ones, like standard Dragon Rulers or Mermail. It can be made to continuously apply pressure over a well protected field, which was achieved with a certain degree of consistency (because if you have to combo 4 random cards to achieve something, it is safe to assume the opponent is also able to combo 4 random cards to get rid of it) for example the Dragunity floods which would happen with relatively low resources and early in the game and be protected with Stardust Dragon and Photon Strike Bounzer, or similarly Infernity combos which would stand behind the protection of the searched traps like Infernity Barrier and Break. Karakuri combos can stand somewhere in between as they are able to OTK if the circumstances present themselves, can either maintain resources or restore them with Bureido draws and can gain some protection if the last card to synchro is Stardust Dragon.

But regardless, not all "floods" are the same, not all are useful and certainly not all are to be assumed to do the same thing, so when deckbuilding a clear goal for them is to be defined. For example, a Hieratic flood will end the game right there as it is an OTK, while a Dragunity flood will be maintained even outside of an OTK even though getting that damage in 1 turn is more difficult. On the other hand, a flood of 2 Machina Fortress, a Gear Gigant X made from Geargiauger which would prevent attacks and a Cyber Dragon is just going to be transformed into a free 4k atk Chimeratech Fortress Dragon for the opponent without ever doing anything.

P.S.: It is strange to suggest summoning multiple 2000+ atk monsters to be a special strategy or a deckbuilding revelation when we are just getting out of 2 Dragon Ruler formats which just followed Mermail Formats.

You sir, have some interesting viewpoints and a lot of time. Try it out

Reasoning constructed upon facts is not dependent on viewpoint, facts can be proven or disproven as can the structure of the reasoning, proving the reasoning to be true or false.

My latest post takes about a couple of minutes for people with at least average linguistic skills, provided they already have the information they are presenting of course.

I at least know ygo enough to be able to tell the general quality of a deck below a certain level without actually using it, as do most people with at least a little experience. Because in reality I do not have that much time, I will not try it out, sorry.

I agree. BUT. some people are readers..some actually like experience on the feild. This is why they have different types of colleges. If you had enough time to think, process, and write this entire entry nobody but me found interesting, then i'm ssure you have ennough time to Try it. So again i say: Try it

Considering I have a (roughly) 1000 line remote access system explorer program on c for unix to write for a university project within the next 48 hours, which is the reason I am not visiting my family for christmas, no, I do not have the time to try a gogogo-gagaga-geargia-zexal weapon deck. Besides, I don't enjoy losing that much to try things for which I know how they would turn out.

But you do have time to argue with me about it.


Okay.




you can't know if you haven't tried btw.


...Unless your pshycic O.O

Or you know this game.

not even a hypothesis from the smartest man living today (Stephen Hawking arguably) has went on with a hypothesis without attempting to prove his theory right. If you haven't tried it, you can't know.

I've been testing my theory on ygo for the past 5 years consistently and for several years before that, you do not need to practice every single instance, that would imply theory is useless. This to be specific is proven by precedent.

With every possible build for a certain deck..you kinda have to. plus this deck can easily stomp on the 2 you've posted (given certain adjustments in the side-deck region).



JS

That is what theory and experience are for, so that you don't have to. That would suggest that to confirm gravity you would have to test every object on earth before accepting it.

Considering the second deck I posted can consistently go for Pleiades at +1 or 141, which can clear every Xyz there (including utopia equipped with both zexal weapons), most of which are usually made at -1 in your deck, while I run a control core of 3 summon responses and 3 bouncing cards (which of course deal with extra deck monsters), I'm going to go ahead and not believe your stomping comment.

Pleiades: a rank 5 ol that sends card from the feild to the hand. 2 meterials ussually. I wonder if pleadeas can withstand a swarm of monsters than can easily kill him.


I bid you good day sir

Use the 'Cyber Repair Plant' 'Cyber Dragon Core' searched to search 'Chronomaly Golden Jet', then banish the 'Cyber Dragon Core' in the graveyard to special summon 'Cyber Dragon' and summon the jet, increase its level by 1 and summon Pleiades. That makes it a 141 since every card here was provided by a single 'Cyber Dragon Core'. Pleiades then in the controlling player's turn bounces 1 Xyz to the extra deck then destroys one by battle if one is below 2500 (most there are, you are speaking of a swarm so there are at least 2), then in the opponent's turn it bounces the third Xyz, then is left to face off with 2500 atk vs whatever is left. Considering this is about turn 2 or 3 that pleiades can drop easily and you are speaking of a swarm of monsters, I assume you opened a couple of geargiagear and accels to make that happen in this deck. In that case I suggest a more geargia focused build.

Ryuuji Takasu wrote:

Pleiades: a rank 5 ol that sends card from the feild to the hand. 2 meterials ussually. I wonder if pleadeas can withstand a swarm of monsters than can easily kill him.


I bid you good day sir

I bid you good day sir

And yes i did

also i was considering adding a few more geargias to replace gogogo gigas and add +1 gogogo giant or golem. I was told that gogogo ghost is good for making a more rank 4 focused deck but i don't think so.

Ryuuji Takasu wrote:

Ryuuji Takasu wrote:

Pleiades: a rank 5 ol that sends card from the feild to the hand. 2 meterials ussually. I wonder if pleadeas can withstand a swarm of monsters than can easily kill him.


I bid you good day sir

I bid you good day sir

Try not to spam.

Al-bhed wrote:

Ryuuji Takasu wrote:

Ryuuji Takasu wrote:

Pleiades: a rank 5 ol that sends card from the feild to the hand. 2 meterials ussually. I wonder if pleadeas can withstand a swarm of monsters than can easily kill him.


I bid you good day sir

I bid you good day sir

Try not to spam.

i edited..can't help it. thinking is scattered for me. ADD

I seriously don't know what is going on here...
Anyway great article Al, hope you do well on your paper

THE DEBATE CONTINUES!
FEATURING: LEOKANE ESTRADA DRAGMIRE!

So I've played against him with Fire Fists while he used his deck that he keeps going on about in a match and he beat me. So now I'm vouching for him...oh yeah I also told him to screenshot his wins for more proof than me vouching...cause you know...not hard to beat me...but I used Fire Fists! *Cries*

Leokane wrote:

THE DEBATE CONTINUES!
FEATURING: LEOKANE ESTRADA DRAGMIRE!

So I've played against him with Fire Fists while he used his deck that he keeps going on about in a match and he beat me. So now I'm vouching for him...oh yeah I also told him to screenshot his wins for more proof than me vouching...cause you know...not hard to beat me...but I used Fire Fists! *Cries*

.................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................  ill have to take a different approach   

Aaaand now the topic is stretched. I'll just break this into a different topic, the input of vague arguements can happen in the other one.